Timing question.

[IHateHacks]

Hey, nice avatar!!

I didn't know your car looked so good.

Is your car lowered?

[supramacist]

LOL no one knows. I hardly ever post pics of the entire thing.

It's not lowered yet and currently has a cf hood. I took this pic after washing and detailing a few years ago. I don't have any new ones yet. I'm waiting for completion. Thanks for the compliment.

I still can't find a front strut tower bar. Does anyone have any ideas as to where I should look besides HPF and Titan motor sports and the dealership.

EDIT: just for the record. Today when I fill my coolant system. I'm going to try it without the belching and see what's up.

[supramacist]

Update.

New afm new air filter which I'll post a pic of later..., cause it's special.
I get it timed. The check engine light is staying on solid. I kill it start it again after a few drags on the stogie. Start it. No check engine light, no codes...., yet. I go out to check the timing and it advanced upon start up and by the time I get back to the check engine light I'm flashing 51.

I go back out and I adjust the idle down as far as I can and it's still running around 12* after tdc.

I unplug the battery, After shutting it off. I'm going to go and try it again and see what happens. It almost has to be the throttle position sensor. I keep asking myself if moving the dizzy forward will enable me to adjust the timing in a fashion to solve the 51?????

But I really don't know. I'm just a gear head with some native talent.
I'm not a mechanic. I'm trying desperately to keep this on a level that doesn't exceed my abilities.

That being said.... Any thoughts? I'll be back after while.
Back to the garage. Thanks for reading.

EDIT: I topped off the coolant this morning. I left the funnel in with some coolant in it and shaked the car a bit and pressed on some hoses and let it sit for a good while. Till it was obvious that it was good. I lifted the funnel enough to get a finger under it. She's max'd, I capped her of at the brim and cleaned up my mess.

The car wasn't jacked up or anything. So I'll leave it till I get this 51 handled.
If she doesn't stop talking smack I may feed her a shoe.

So the afm solved the 24 code. I'm half way there.

[cre]

How are you adjusting the idle? You should know better than to try and adjust it manually by now...

And wadda ya mean gotta be the TPS? You Haven't checked that yet? BTW, you shouldn't set the timing without the car at idle. From what I understand, you can do it, but when in diagnostic mode the ECU doesn't set the timing advance to a flat 10?BTDC, it merely stays on the default (RPM based) map with no adjustments per the trim sensor inputs.

Oh, and if you keep getting a code 51 then check the damned IDL switch already! sheesh...

[supramacist]

So before even trying to time the engine I should hit operating temp 1st?

I normally get a cold reading and then when it plains out I re-adjust.

I'm not even sure what you mean about timing it manually. There's another way? Besides relocating the dist tooth or the the idle screw whick I have looked at and it's maxed out 1 way basically and I'm not sure I should move it but hell if I turn a screw it's still being done manually.

I'm not getting something here. I'm not trying to be short I'm sorry if it sounds that way. I'm just unsure of the thought process I need to allocate my time and energy to at this point. Check the tps. Ok. Now that takes a trip to the tsrm because I know nothing about it. But I do have a multi meter. So. I'll try it again after I see if trying to reset aids my plight...

Which clearly it's probably not going to.

What's IDL???

[cre]

I said you shouldn't be trying to adjust the idle manually. Naturally you set the base timing manually... while at idle.

The order you need to approach this from is as follows:

Fix the cause of the error code. Code 51 is usually due to the TPS being misaligned or defective OR moving the throttle plate while in the diag mode.

Another cause for a code 51 and idle issues can be if the throttle stop screw has been improperly adjusted or if the dashpot is adjusted incorrectly or stuck.

The IDL switch in the TPS is what the ECU looks for to know the throttle is closed. Details on testing it are in the same section as the TPS alignment details. TSRM > EFI System > Air Induction system > Throttle Body (7M-GE)


Until you have got the idle back within the approximate range and the code 51 taken care of you shouldn't touch the timing. The timing can cause erratic timing issues as the engine falters, but it's not going to cause a steady increase.


EDIT: I don't think the ECU checks the coolant temp when in the diagnostic mode... I could be wrong but I think it ignores input from all of the trim sensors.

[IHateHacks]

Fact: You had your TPS off of your car before.

Fact: You have code 51.

Fact: Your code 51 is 100% related to you taking off the TPS.

Give this a whirl: Loosen the TPS mounting screws and move the TPS adjustment out counter clockwise while it is running. Wait a few seconds, and see if the code is gone.

Check out this thread, pay attention to post #9. And #10.

HELP! my engine warms up in reverse order - SupraMania

[cre]

I doubt this is the case but...

Code 51 is also related to the A/C system which you've removed from the vehicle. If errant currant is entering the A/C signal line to the ECU this too can cause a code 51. The solution here is to ground the A/C signal line to the ECU. (sorry I don't recall specifically which line it is though)

[supramacist]

Alright here's where I sit. I'm adding these pics just so you guys can see where I'm working.

I had the timing set where I wanted it at idle. Now the dizzy is still max'd out. So I went to the idle screw. Minor babystep adjustment and then a re tweak of the dizzy to not have it bottomed out and I was in.

No more codes. The idle is on. Short test drive. Pull codes..., all's well.
1 more test drive. Now I can tell that the idle up for parking lot turns is working. I find myself having to rev the engine a few times to get it to quill back to base line. I make it home and it's reving at 2k rpms again.

And I'm right back to starting over. I'm closing in on it. I just need to grind it out and the 51 will be gone.

But...., why the hell does it keep coming back after a decent miles worth of test drive???? That's my problem.


Edit. I guess the dashpot is the piece in the 2nd pic. Yes, no? Well that thing Has been cleaned off and I don't think it's as springy as it should be. It seems better after I covered everything and applied pb blaster. BUt it's noticabley slow at going in and out.

[supramacist]

Alright. I'm back to it go and get the base line set again and get rid of the 51.

Once I get this bitch starting and running and timed. I'm not going to test drive it. Something bigger is still going on.

EDIT: Thanks for that link HH. Helpful, very.