Car runs like crap, spits, sputters etc! HELP - Page 3

supradaddy0803 · 05-14-2007, 03:50 PM

Ok I know this is gonna sound a bit silly but when I first got into mark 3's I did it and I have worked on cars since I was about 12. The thing was back like 1999 I didnt have internet access and I was stuck in the military in South Dakota with no reference to anything 7MGE so when doing the timing belt I got it 180 out. Sad thing is it still runs fine at idle but when you push the gas it will die real fast. Sounds funny but it will run beleive me I have seen old fords and chevy's run 180 out and they sound like crap. I am just saying this since you did the head gasket maybe check it because it shouldnt throw black smoke if you retard the throttle the computer shouldnt let it. I know you are running out of options might as well a shot in the dark it is a none interferance motor or so the toyota techs tell me so you wont bend anything. And by 180 out the cam marks were pointing down instead of up and the crank mark was pointing at them at the zero mark. But it is worth a try with what you are describing.

Z'mnypit · 05-14-2007, 04:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by supradaddy0803

Ok I know this is gonna sound a bit silly but when I first got into mark 3's I did it and I have worked on cars since I was about 12. The thing was back like 1999 I didnt have internet access and I was stuck in the military in South Dakota with no reference to anything 7MGE so when doing the timing belt I got it 180 out. Sad thing is it still runs fine at idle but when you push the gas it will die real fast. Sounds funny but it will run beleive me I have seen old fords and chevy's run 180 out and they sound like crap. I am just saying this since you did the head gasket maybe check it because it shouldnt throw black smoke if you retard the throttle the computer shouldnt let it. I know you are running out of options might as well a shot in the dark it is a none interferance motor or so the toyota techs tell me so you wont bend anything. And by 180 out the cam marks were pointing down instead of up and the crank mark was pointing at them at the zero mark. But it is worth a try with what you are describing.

Thats weird but at this point Im willing to try anything. Ill see if I cant do it this afternoon.

It also makes me begin to wonder if the timing is truly right. I set the crank pulley on 0 then aligned both cam marks with the marks on the backing plate. Now the thing is, does if matter if the the crank needs to be on 0 on the up stroke or the down stroke. Or is it the same either way?

supradaddy0803 · 05-14-2007, 05:14 PM

With the 7mge you just take the distributor cap off and when it is pointing at number one then you got it a TDC. With the turbo and not having a distributor I am not sure. Take it and align it where you got it now and try turning it one more revolution and timing it at 0 for the second time. and see what it does. may save you on a rebuild and might explain the rod knock too if the timing is off. Look in your tsrm and see what the procedure is for doing it that is my best suggestion when I bought mine for my 86.5 I was supprised at what all I was doing wrong.

j3pz · 05-14-2007, 09:44 PM

almost sounds like you got a leak.

as for the cps timing,
http://www.supramania.com/forums/sho...ghlight=timing

Z'mnypit · 05-14-2007, 11:36 PM

Update. Pulled the #1 plug and turned the crank to 0. Stuck a screwdriver in there and the piston was at the bottom. Spun the crank around till the piston was at the top and lined the crank up with 0. pulled the the timing cover and the cam sprocket marks were pointed down. I removed the belt, lined them up with the marks and reinstalled. Set the idle with the CPS to 800 or so and took it for a spin. Still does the same thing. Runs good with no boost then once the boost kicks in its a dog, it goes slow. Nose dive slow, then it starts jerking. I dont understand this stupid car.

IHateHacks · 05-15-2007, 01:34 AM

Theres no way the #1 piston was at bottom dead center when the crank pulley notch lined up with the 0 degree mark on the lower timing belt cover. Everytime the 0 degree mark lines up with the notch on the crank pulley, the #1 piston is on TDC. Its mechanically impossible for the piston to not be at TDC when the notch lines up. The crankshaft is keyed with the crank pulley so that it lines up with the 0 mark everytime the #1 piston is at TDC. Which TDC is another story, but I already went over this with you. Bottom line, when the crank pulley notch lines up with the 0 degree mark and the cam gear matchmarks line up with the notches in the inner timing belt cover, you are on TDC of the compression stroke and you can install the CPS as described in the TSRM. If the crank pulley notch lines up with the 0 degree mark and the cam gear matchmarks are 180 degrees to the notches in the inner timing belt cover then you are on TDC on the exhaust stroke. The #1 piston is at TDC everytime the crank pulley notch lines up with the 0 degree mark.

supradaddy0803 · 05-15-2007, 05:33 AM

What I was getting at is there is 2 TDC combustion and exhaust it is basic mechanics. so it is possible for it to lined up at TDC on the exhaust stroke the piston has to be up to remove the exhaust. But as I said it was worth a try it fixed my 86.5 N/A but like I told him I wasnt sure about a turbo. Because if you line up the 0 and the distributor is not lined up with the number 1 point then you are at the exhaust stroke. But seeing as the 7MGTE doesnt have a distributor I figured why not try it.

Z'mnypit · 05-15-2007, 01:00 PM

I dont know! I guess my focus is on the 52 code now. Im going to try and swap the sensors to rid of the code but knowing my luck it isnt going to help. Any thought on how to remove the back KS with out removing the starter?

Thanks!

IHateHacks · 05-15-2007, 05:11 PM

Can't do it, you must remove the starter to access the rear knock sensor on an 87 turbo supra. Trust me. You can't even get the connector off with the starter bolted in.

Replace the knock sensors and let us know what happens.

Z'mnypit · 05-15-2007, 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IHateHacks

Can't do it, you must remove the starter to access the rear knock sensor on an 87 turbo supra. Trust me. You can't even get the connector off with the starter bolted in.

Replace the knock sensors and let us know what happens.

I just got the plug off the other day when I rewired it without removing the starter. It wasnt hard. Im going to do the "KS rewire" mod 1st and see if that works before I pull the sensors.

05-14-2007, 03:50 PM	#21
supradaddy0803 12psi boost Join Date: May 2006 Location: Athens, TX Posts: 308	Ok I know this is gonna sound a bit silly but when I first got into mark 3's I did it and I have worked on cars since I was about 12. The thing was back like 1999 I didnt have internet access and I was stuck in the military in South Dakota with no reference to anything 7MGE so when doing the timing belt I got it 180 out. Sad thing is it still runs fine at idle but when you push the gas it will die real fast. Sounds funny but it will run beleive me I have seen old fords and chevy's run 180 out and they sound like crap. I am just saying this since you did the head gasket maybe check it because it shouldnt throw black smoke if you retard the throttle the computer shouldnt let it. I know you are running out of options might as well a shot in the dark it is a none interferance motor or so the toyota techs tell me so you wont bend anything. And by 180 out the cam marks were pointing down instead of up and the crank mark was pointing at them at the zero mark. But it is worth a try with what you are describing. __________________ 1987 supra NA 5 speed 1JZGTE swap Tokico Illumina 2 and Eibach springs Tokico pillow blocks Suspension Techniques front and rear sway bar HKS super dragger cat-back exhaust plus test pipe Greddy Profec B spec 2 boost controller HKS type 1 turbo timer Supra sport solid steel drive shaft Walboro 255 fuel pump JZA70 Front end mod 18" Volk Racing AV3 18x8.5 front 18x9.5 rear

05-14-2007, 05:14 PM	#23
supradaddy0803 12psi boost Join Date: May 2006 Location: Athens, TX Posts: 308	With the 7mge you just take the distributor cap off and when it is pointing at number one then you got it a TDC. With the turbo and not having a distributor I am not sure. Take it and align it where you got it now and try turning it one more revolution and timing it at 0 for the second time. and see what it does. may save you on a rebuild and might explain the rod knock too if the timing is off. Look in your tsrm and see what the procedure is for doing it that is my best suggestion when I bought mine for my 86.5 I was supprised at what all I was doing wrong. __________________ 1987 supra NA 5 speed 1JZGTE swap Tokico Illumina 2 and Eibach springs Tokico pillow blocks Suspension Techniques front and rear sway bar HKS super dragger cat-back exhaust plus test pipe Greddy Profec B spec 2 boost controller HKS type 1 turbo timer Supra sport solid steel drive shaft Walboro 255 fuel pump JZA70 Front end mod 18" Volk Racing AV3 18x8.5 front 18x9.5 rear

05-14-2007, 09:44 PM	#24
j3pz 500whp yet? Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Mechanicsville, MD, US of A, 20659 Posts: 1,060	almost sounds like you got a leak. as for the cps timing, http://www.supramania.com/forums/sho...ghlight=timing __________________ 88 N/A w/ 5spd - stock - not running, bhg 87 turbo/targa w/ 5spd- fidanza light weight flywheel, new oem slave cylinder, apexi air filter, no ac and no heat

05-14-2007, 11:36 PM	#25
Z'mnypit 3" Exhaust Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Springville, AL Posts: 57	Update. Pulled the #1 plug and turned the crank to 0. Stuck a screwdriver in there and the piston was at the bottom. Spun the crank around till the piston was at the top and lined the crank up with 0. pulled the the timing cover and the cam sprocket marks were pointed down. I removed the belt, lined them up with the marks and reinstalled. Set the idle with the CPS to 800 or so and took it for a spin. Still does the same thing. Runs good with no boost then once the boost kicks in its a dog, it goes slow. Nose dive slow, then it starts jerking. I dont understand this stupid car. __________________ -99 Z28 A4 6.7L "2006 LS1tech Calendar cover car" 408ci, Comp 244/248, Patriot Stage III LS6 heads, FAST 90mm Intake, NW 90mm TB, SVO 42lb'rs, Pacesetter LT's, ORY, 4L80e, Yank 3400, Motive 3.73's, Racetronix, TNT 200shot, Fikse FM10's -2005 Silverado Crew Cab 5.3L (Towing), Silverbirch, Hooker Aero Chamber, blacked out windows, sittin on 22's - Two 87 turbo'd/targa top'd supras (Under Construction)

05-15-2007, 05:33 AM	#27
supradaddy0803 12psi boost Join Date: May 2006 Location: Athens, TX Posts: 308	What I was getting at is there is 2 TDC combustion and exhaust it is basic mechanics. so it is possible for it to lined up at TDC on the exhaust stroke the piston has to be up to remove the exhaust. But as I said it was worth a try it fixed my 86.5 N/A but like I told him I wasnt sure about a turbo. Because if you line up the 0 and the distributor is not lined up with the number 1 point then you are at the exhaust stroke. But seeing as the 7MGTE doesnt have a distributor I figured why not try it. __________________ 1987 supra NA 5 speed 1JZGTE swap Tokico Illumina 2 and Eibach springs Tokico pillow blocks Suspension Techniques front and rear sway bar HKS super dragger cat-back exhaust plus test pipe Greddy Profec B spec 2 boost controller HKS type 1 turbo timer Supra sport solid steel drive shaft Walboro 255 fuel pump JZA70 Front end mod 18" Volk Racing AV3 18x8.5 front 18x9.5 rear

05-15-2007, 01:34 AM	#26
IHateHacks 20psi boost Join Date: May 2006 Location: New Haven/Hamden Posts: 793	Theres no way the #1 piston was at bottom dead center when the crank pulley notch lined up with the 0 degree mark on the lower timing belt cover. Everytime the 0 degree mark lines up with the notch on the crank pulley, the #1 piston is on TDC. Its mechanically impossible for the piston to not be at TDC when the notch lines up. The crankshaft is keyed with the crank pulley so that it lines up with the 0 mark everytime the #1 piston is at TDC. Which TDC is another story, but I already went over this with you. Bottom line, when the crank pulley notch lines up with the 0 degree mark and the cam gear matchmarks line up with the notches in the inner timing belt cover, you are on TDC of the compression stroke and you can install the CPS as described in the TSRM. If the crank pulley notch lines up with the 0 degree mark and the cam gear matchmarks are 180 degrees to the notches in the inner timing belt cover then you are on TDC on the exhaust stroke. The #1 piston is at TDC *everytime* the crank pulley notch lines up with the 0 degree mark.

05-15-2007, 01:00 PM	#28
Z'mnypit 3" Exhaust Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Springville, AL Posts: 57	I dont know! I guess my focus is on the 52 code now. Im going to try and swap the sensors to rid of the code but knowing my luck it isnt going to help. Any thought on how to remove the back KS with out removing the starter? Thanks! __________________ -99 Z28 A4 6.7L "2006 LS1tech Calendar cover car" 408ci, Comp 244/248, Patriot Stage III LS6 heads, FAST 90mm Intake, NW 90mm TB, SVO 42lb'rs, Pacesetter LT's, ORY, 4L80e, Yank 3400, Motive 3.73's, Racetronix, TNT 200shot, Fikse FM10's -2005 Silverado Crew Cab 5.3L (Towing), Silverbirch, Hooker Aero Chamber, blacked out windows, sittin on 22's - Two 87 turbo'd/targa top'd supras (Under Construction)

05-15-2007, 05:11 PM	#29
IHateHacks 20psi boost Join Date: May 2006 Location: New Haven/Hamden Posts: 793	Can't do it, you must remove the starter to access the rear knock sensor on an 87 turbo supra. Trust me. You can't even get the connector off with the starter bolted in. Replace the knock sensors and let us know what happens.

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