Toyota Supra Forums! Join the Supra forum! - 700rwhp supra for roadracing and daily driving

Toyota Supra Forums! Join the Supra forum! (http://www.toyota-supra.info/forums/)

- MKIV Supra (http://www.toyota-supra.info/forums/mkiv-supra/)

- - 700rwhp supra for roadracing and daily driving (http://www.toyota-supra.info/forums/mkiv-supra/18357-700rwhp-supra-for-roadracing-and-daily-driving.html)

700rwhp supra for roadracing and daily driving

( me English not so good but i understand majority) Now all of the compulsory tests have been done and the car was stripped and searched for rot Etc..

I am so freaking excited! I need to learn as much as possible about this model.
I currently drive a Impreza @ 365 whp so i know what a little power feels like.

My goals are 700 whp (feels a bit scary in my pops mustang but its addicting)
Street driveable
track on weekend (most likely Circuit)

Budget isnt really set as i dont know what im working with as yet but Wiling to fork out the bucks for the quality stuff..

What im lloking for now is rebuilding the internals of the 2jzgte so that it can handle those track days and while upgrading the power of the engine working on suspension aswell.

Firstly where can i start for building the engine?
Rods, pistons etc....
Whats the process, brands Im like totaly new at this and any links would be great.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Killongy (Post 90998)

( me English not so good but i understand majority) Now all of the compulsory tests have been done and the car was stripped and searched for rot Etc..

I am so freaking excited! I need to learn as much as possible about this model.
I currently drive a Impreza @ 365 whp so i know what a little power feels like.

My goals are 700 whp (feels a bit scary in my pops mustang but its addicting)
Street driveable
track on weekend (most likely Circuit)

Budget isnt really set as i dont know what im working with as yet but Wiling to fork out the bucks for the quality stuff..

What im lloking for now is rebuilding the internals of the 2jzgte so that it can handle those track days and while upgrading the power of the engine working on suspension as well.

Firstly where can i start for building the engine?
Rods, pistons etc...

Whats the process, brands Im like totaly new at this and any links would be great.

If you don't mind me asking, which circuit track(s) will you be roadracing? Dover?
.
I'd suggest that we agree on an overall plan for your build before we get into specific brands/links:

You asked "...where can i start for building the engine?...rods, pistons, etc.". The exact answer to this question is: nowhere.

Please allow me to explain. You should definitely NOT start by "rebuilding the internals". 100% for sure. Please, please, please, please (!!!) tell me why you think you need to start by "rebuilding the internals"???? 700rwhp is a walk in the park for a bone-stock 2jz-gte!!! Really!!! In theory, you could even roadrace it at 900rwhp and it'd be just fine with oem bone-stock "internals"!!! I MUST find out who keeps spreading the nasty rumors that the 2jz-gte internals need to be "rebuilt" in order to handle power. Who on earth told you that - where did you hear that or how did you get that impression? Please help me track down the source of this nasty rumor. Sigh.

Next, note that the bone-stock Mkiv TT suspension is also just fine for roadracing too!

To build a 700rwhp daily-driven + roadraced Mkiv TT, here's what you'll need:
Turbo kit (~67mm)

Aftermarket cams (264s)

Fuel system upgrade kit*

Engine management electronics (piggyback or ecu replacement)

Wider rims (9.5" front, 11.5" rear)

Aftermarket exhaust and midpipe

Aftermarket intercooler

Aftermarket clutch (assuming you'll be roadracing a 6spd)

Electronic Boost controller

A budget for race fuel (110 octane), or alcohol injection system

Aside from other minor odds-and-ends**, that's pretty much it. Notice my list has no "internals" (unless you want to count the cams). It also has no suspension upgrades. Again, both the oem 2jz-gte and the oem Mkiv TT suspension are just fine for roadracing. If you're super-serious about regularly roadracing, you'll eventually want to invest in some Penske's, Moton's, or Ohlins's...but to me, that's nothing you need to do on the initial 'build'.

*If you set your goals down a bit to ~650rwhp, you can even skip the fuel system completely and go with a big alcohol injection kit instead. This will save you $$$ on race fuel. However, if you have 750rwhp+ in mind eventually, there's no way around a full fuel system upgrade and race fuel.

**Other minor odds and ends include things for circuit track days like an aftermarket driver's seat (holds the driver in position better for roadracing), a 5-pt harness bar (and 5pt harness), roadrace tires (R-compound) for track use, special fluids (diff, coolant), etc.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pwpanas (Post 91017)

If you don't mind me asking, which circuit track(s) will you be roadracing? Dover?
.
I'd suggest that we agree on an overall plan for your build before we get into specific brands/links:

You asked "...where can i start for building the engine?...rods, pistons, etc.". The exact answer to this question is: nowhere.

Please allow me to explain. You should definitely NOT start by "rebuilding the internals". 100% for sure. Please, please, please, please (!!!) tell me why you think you need to start by "rebuilding the internals"???? 700rwhp is a walk in the park for a bone-stock 2jz-gte!!! Really!!! In theory, you could even roadrace it at 900rwhp and it'd be just fine with oem bone-stock "internals"!!! I MUST find out who keeps spreading the nasty rumors that the 2jz-gte internals need to be "rebuilt" in order to handle power. Who on earth told you that - where did you hear that or how did you get that impression? Please help me track down the source of this nasty rumor. Sigh.

Next, note that the bone-stock Mkiv TT suspension is also just fine for roadracing too!

To build a 700rwhp daily-driven + roadraced Mkiv TT, here's what you'll need:
Turbo kit (~67mm)

Aftermarket cams (264s)

Fuel system upgrade kit*

Engine management electronics (piggyback or ecu replacement)

Wider rims (9.5" front, 11.5" rear)

Aftermarket exhaust and midpipe

Aftermarket intercooler

Aftermarket clutch (assuming you'll be roadracing a 6spd)

Electronic Boost controller

A budget for race fuel (110 octane), or alcohol injection system

Aside from other minor odds-and-ends**, that's pretty much it. Notice my list has no "internals" (unless you want to count the cams). It also has no suspension upgrades. Again, both the oem 2jz-gte and the oem Mkiv TT suspension are just fine for roadracing. If you're super-serious about regularly roadracing, you'll eventually want to invest in some Penske's, Moton's, or Ohlins's...but to me, that's nothing you need to do on the initial 'build'.

*If you set your goals down a bit to ~650rwhp, you can even skip the fuel system completely and go with a big alcohol injection kit instead. This will save you $$$ on race fuel. However, if you have 750rwhp+ in mind eventually, there's no way around a full fuel system upgrade and race fuel.

**Other minor odds and ends include things for circuit track days like an aftermarket driver's seat (holds the driver in position better for roadracing), a 5-pt harness bar (and 5pt harness), roadrace tires (R-compound) for track use, special fluids (diff, coolant), etc.

Mostly Dover not many roadrace tracks in the well actually no roadrace tracks in jamaica =(

I cant really find the rest of the sites i visited to but this is one site that i managed to find after about a hr or so of searching my history
http://www.mkivsupra.net/vbb/showthr...2JZ-GTE-engine

Thats what i recall made me think that the engine needed to be rebuilt and also the thought of having a good foundation for the power.

So for the overall plan where do we start?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Killongy (Post 91024)

Regarding that link, check out the post by Chiefgroover, and the responses by Matt Harwood and Morpheus. They're the only ones on that thread that are talking any sense at all, imo. However, do note they're talking about a VVTi 2jz-gte. Oh, and I've posted some clarifying remarks on that thread as well. :)
Do you have, or will you be getting a VVTi 2jz-gte, or a non-VVTi 2jz-gte?
.
Where do you start? With the list I posted above, of course. :) Just start reading from where I wrote:
"To build a 700rwhp daily-driven + roadraced Mkiv TT, here's what you'll need:".
Note that the list assumes you're starting with a well-maintained Mkiv Supra Turbo, bone-stock.
What questions do you have about the components in that list?

On a similar note

In your opinion, would it be worth having Titan motorsports build an 800 rwhp engine? If so, does rebuilding the internals help increase your low end power? I'm also curious about the width of the wheels I can put under a widebody. The Top Secret widebody fenders are 33mm wider in the front and 50mm wider in the rear. Can I fit 13" (335's) under the rear end and can I fit 10" (255's) under the front?

Quote:

Originally Posted by CustomMKIV (Post 91136)

In your opinion, would it be worth having Titan motorsports build an 800 rwhp engine?...

Titan Motorsports would absolutely LOVE to take your $$$ for this project, and they'd be perfectly within your specifications to ship you a new oem shortblock from Toyota, with absolutely zero parts/labor invested on their part. So in short, my answer to your question is absolutely not. A Titan-built 2jz-gte would only be worth your $ for a goal of 1100rwhp, up to 1600rwhp.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CustomMKIV (Post 91136)

...If so, does rebuilding the internals help increase your low end power?...

No, unless you go with higher-than-oem compression pistons. However, the higher-than-oem compression pistons will require you to either run an even higher octane of race fuel ($) or alcohol/E85, and/or it will limit the boost you can run with any given octane.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CustomMKIV (Post 91136)

...I'm also curious about the width of the wheels I can put under a widebody. The Top Secret widebody fenders are 33mm wider in the front and 50mm wider in the rear. Can I fit 13" (335's) under the rear end...

Probably not...at least not without additional width added by the shop you use to install the widebody kit.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CustomMKIV (Post 91136)

...and can I fit 10" (255's) under the front?

Yes, but 255s are too narrow to match with 335s on the rear. You should run at least 285s with that 10" rim...or get a 10.5" or 11" rim to run the 285s or 305s, which should also fit under the Top Secret widebody front.

My question then would be, Do I have to change the offset or do I need to make sure I order the right offset so I don't cause any issues. My main concern is the front. I don't want to lose any of my turn radius by going too wide. I'm pretty sure the 335's will fit under the rear fenders being 2" wider than stock. The front fenders will be about 1.3" wider.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CustomMKIV (Post 91186)

My question then would be, Do I have to change the offset or do I need to make sure I order the right offset so I don't cause any issues.

Yes, you'll need to change the offset from oem; you do need to make sure you order the right offset so you don't cause any issues.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CustomMKIV (Post 91186)

My main concern is the front. I don't want to lose any of my turn radius by going too wide.

Agreed this is a concern.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CustomMKIV (Post 91186)

I'm pretty sure the 335's will fit under the rear fenders being 2" wider than stock.

But what about the 335's? The oem rear tires are 255's...which means the tires will be 80mm (3.1496 inches) wider than oem. Are you 100% sure they'll fit? :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by CustomMKIV (Post 91186)

The front fenders will be about 1.3" wider.

Same deal here. Oem-width front tires are 235s. 285s match that 10" rim you were planning (not 255s!), which is 50mm (1.9685 inches) wider.

Not exactly 100%

No. I'm not 100% the wheels will fit. I've been reading all the forums to see what others are fitting on the stock body and trying to calculate how wide I can go from there. It will probably be best to get the body work done and then measure my clearances for exact fits. I was trying to figure it out so I could order the wheels since it will be at least 6 months before I can get the car in for the wide body.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CustomMKIV (Post 91203)

Your 335s will barely fit under the widebody, on the rear. Worst case, you may have to have the bodyshop modify the widebody kit, to make it 1/4" wider on the rear...and that assumes the offsets on your rims are optimal. On the fronts, 285s actually fit with the oem body (not widebody!)...again, assuming a perfect rim offset... no problem at all with rubbing (as long as you don't go crazy about how much you lower the suspension...

With a bit of work (pounding the inner fenderwells, trimming the fender lip), you can actually get 315s to squeeze into the oem fenders.

Oh, and I'm curious. For only 700rwhp, 315s are more than enough rubber to do the job. Why go widebody and 335s?

I'm actually looking into more than 700WHP. I also like the wide body and the loook of the wider wheels an tires. I'm will only lower the car as much is needed for optimum look and performance. I'm going to work with the shop after the body work is done to get the right offsets and wheel measurements. I'm thinking at least 800WHP. My original plan was 900WHP and that's more what I'm looking for.

I'm currently running a twin turbo engine in a N/A body with a stock 5 speed transmission and N/A rear end. I've got 400WHP with 410lbft of torque according to the dyno. I'm currently running it on premium pump gas.

What's the best way to get to 900WHP from where I am right now? Do I need to upgrade to the 6 speed Getrag transmission and a different rear end to handle the power? Most performance shops are recommending a total rebuild from the bottom up. My understanding is that I should be able to meet my goals without touching the internals. Any thoughts on this?

Quote:

Originally Posted by CustomMKIV (Post 91287)

...I'm currently running a twin turbo engine in a N/A body with a stock 5 speed transmission and N/A rear end. I've got 400WHP with 410lbft of torque according to the dyno. I'm currently running it on premium pump gas.

What's the best way to get to 900WHP from where I am right now? Do I need to upgrade to the 6 speed Getrag transmission and a different rear end to handle the power? Most performance shops are recommending a total rebuild from the bottom up. My understanding is that I should be able to meet my goals without touching the internals. Any thoughts on this?

Yep the oem n/a 5spd won't handle 900whp, so the 6spd is a must. I don't have max hp specs on the n/a diff, but I'm about 95%+ certain you'll have to change that too.
You could run 850rwhp (6spd) reliably with the oem 2jz-gte bottom end. 900rwhp is pushing it, imo. Of course you'll need 272 cams (preferrably HKS)...and some porting on the head wouldn't hurt either. If you're going to get it ported, make sure it's by someone who can prove their results on the 2jz-gte. A bad porting job will make worse power than an oem head.