Stock Block - Page 5

Dboz · 01-01-2006, 05:13 AM

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Originally Posted by pwpanas

I agree with you about the 2jz-gte - given the horsepower restrictions in those races, it's just not the optimal choice. On the other hand, you have to admit the vast majority of the drivers that have roadraced the mk4 hard core with 3sgte's are at a skill level quite a bit better than intermediate-level.

yea the 3sgte stroker 2.2L is more then sufficent to put out those hp reliablely and win races..

well it was up to toyota to use it.. i really wanna write a letter and ask them why they never really used the 2jz for any kind of race.. i know its whole lot heavier but still..

anyways check this supra out

pwpanas · 01-01-2006, 05:18 AM

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Originally Posted by Dboz

yea the 3sgte stroker 2.2L is more then sufficent to put out those hp reliablely and win races..

well it was up to toyota to use it.. i really wanna write a letter and ask them why they never really used the 2jz for any kind of race.. i know its whole lot heavier but still..

anyways check this supra out

...

Thanks for posting those pictures - I agree that v8 looks kind of cool in a jza80 engine bay.

On the other hand, it's kind of a shame. With the bone-stock 2jz-gte block's ability to put out over 800rwhp, there's really no need to swap it out (imo). Personally, I'd rather see a 2jz-gte being used in a '68 Cuda than a V8 in a jza80.

Dboz · 01-01-2006, 05:21 AM

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Originally Posted by pwpanas

Thanks for posting those pictures - I agree that v8 looks kind of cool in a jza80 engine bay.

On the other hand, it's kind of a shame. With the bone-stock 2jz-gte block's ability to put out over 800rwhp, there's really no need to swap it out (imo). Personally, I'd rather see a 2jz-gte being used in a '68 Cuda than a V8 in a jza80.

thats the 4.7 litre 2uz-fe =D.. its buttom end can take.. umm we dont know yet haha.. probely somewhere in the 1000+ range.. a bored out one to 5.3 did 1200hp with 20PSI.. lol

the power delivary on that v8 will put the 2jz to shame though

pwpanas · 01-01-2006, 05:24 AM

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Originally Posted by Dboz

thats the 4.7 litre 2uz-fe =D.. its buttom end can take.. umm we dont know yet haha.. probely somewhere in the 1000+ range.. a bored out one to 5.3 did 1200hp with 20PSI.. lol...

Yup and a built 2jz-gte put out 1520rwhp through a powerglide transmission & high-stall torque converter.

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Originally Posted by Dboz

...the power delivary on that v8 will put the 2jz to shame though

Although it might be capable of exceeding 1520rwhp, I sincerely doubt it'll ever make enough power to "put the 2jz to shame".

Dboz · 01-01-2006, 05:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pwpanas

Yup and a built 2jz-gte put out 1520rwhp through a powerglide transmission & high-stall torque converter.
Although it might be capable of exceeding 1520rwhp, I sincerely doubt it'll ever make enough power to "put the 2jz to shame".

im sure the 2uz-fe buttom end is tough or tougher then a 2jz

a built one did 1600whp and probely more haha

its the power deilvary that will put it to shame.. 2jz's will suffer alot more boost lag then a 2uz-fe turboed.. torque numbers and plot will put it away too =D

Dboz · 01-01-2006, 05:30 AM

actually

the 2uz has really bad stock rods.. but the block itself is super strong just like all toyota iron cast blocks.. the pistons arent bad.. the crankshaft is like the 2jz and alot of toyota engines.. overbuilt!

just the huge displacement difference is the biggest advantage over the 2jz

anyways its new years time guys.. 2.5 hours left.. i gotta go party it up! woot

pwpanas · 01-01-2006, 05:31 AM

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Originally Posted by Dboz

im sure the 2uz-fe buttom end is tough or tougher then a 2jz

a built one did 1600whp and probely more haha

its the power deilvary that will put it to shame.. 2jz's will suffer alot more boost lag then a 2uz-fe turboed.. torque numbers and plot will put it away too =D

It has 57% more displacement and two more cylinders, so I'd hope it would at least have some small advantage on an unlimited-budget sponsored-race-team type of build.

Do you have any more data on that one that did 1600whp? I'd be interested in learning more about it.

This does get a bit off-topic though. Although big single turbos, v8 engine swaps and nos are all ways to make more power, I'm waiting for SKILMATIC to fess up that he's way off base with his 650rwhp on stock block & stock twins GUESS. He guessed wrong - whether it was due to faulty arithemtic or his faulty knowledge about the size of the 2jz-gte's oem twins. I think it's pretty important that guys like Evilfurby don't go away from this thread thinking that he'll be able to make 650rwhp with his '97 mk4 tt, using only the oem twins and the stock block, after he buys it.

SKILMATIC · 01-01-2006, 05:35 AM

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It's not pessimistic, it's realistic. The inventor of the a-bomb wasn't on the same type of budget as someone like Evilfurby looking at maxing out the stock block, stock twins horsepower of a used Supra that he's planning to buy. For any reasonable amount of $, you're not going to make 650rwhp using the stock twins alone. In fact, I'll allow you an unreasonable amound of $. You'll never do it even if you spend $25,000.00 on the problem (not counting the cost of the car itself). Is that a reasonable budget, iyo?

Dude, no one ever said anything about cost aspects. I said it is possible to get that much. Even you should agree that it is possible. And if I had 25grand to spend on a motor and I had to use the stock twins. All I would do is max boost, racing fuel, bigger injectors, bigger fuel pump, standalone engine management, bore the engine out w/ stroker kit, exedy multi disc clutch, lightened flywheel with carbon pads, trd diff, better IC and piping, intercooler chiller kit, and 200shot of nitrous(wet kit). Theres your 650rwhp. Stock engine is 320 just the nitrous alone bumps it up to 520(and thats a maybe 1000dollar mod depending on where you get the kit from) I got 24 grand left. Any questions?

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I'm talking about mileage on the turbos. They just don't boost as well if they've got a lot of mileage on them.

O ok thanks for clarifying that.

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I've already told you. I base my data on my own work on my own MK4, my work on other Mk4's, as well as the work of the dozens and dozens of other Mk4 owners that have worked on this problem and posted their results. Now, upon what do you base your BS 650rwhp on stock block & stock twins figure? Faulty mathematics? Lol.

And your still wrong. As I have already maped it out for you.

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No one is arguing with you there, but let's get back to the topic - is your assertion still that you can feasibly make 650rwhp with a stock 2jz-gte block and it's stock twin turbos?

I said the stock motor yes. Engine management, nitrous, and more boost I never said you couldnt use(show me where I said word for word that you couldnt use these things). With these things alone you can get that amount when done right. However, then you claimed that even if I could do anythign to the motor the stock twins wouldnt handle it. Which again is not true.

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Prove it then! This isn't a matter of odds like rolling some dice at Las Vegas. This is a matter of how much air those two little 2jz-gte oem twins can pump. They simply can't pump enough air to produce that much horsepower. It's beyond the capability of those devices, therefore it's not improbable, it's literally impossible.

Now if we go beyond the conditions of your earlier posts and add a big single turbo or a big shot of NO2+fuel to make the horsepower, then of course it can be done. But again, on oem twins and oem block alone, there's just no way.

Bingo now someone is thinking. I never said once you couldnt use nitrous or any other means of management. Just stock block and stock twins. Anything else is a go. Now you are coming to reality. I see the dice is turning in my favor.

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Yes. I'm also sure that YOU shouldn't be posting on MK4 threads, because you're completely uninformed and unqualified to answer any questions about it.

As you have already losed this debate about a mk4. You have already admitted that 650rwhp is attainable on the stock motor with stock twins with the help of nitrous which is a 1000dollar mod. Well what happened with the rest of the 24grand? I never said once you couldnt use nitrous. Thank you for debating sir. You did ok. Not bad for a newbie.

The funny thing is while I am not qualified to answer these questions you have just debacled yourself in your own debate. First you say "you need a unattainable amount of money to make 650rwhp on the stock block and stock twins" then you say "o but its attainable with nitrous which is a 1000dollar mod." Maybe you will take my advice and chose your battles much more wisely.

SKILMATIC · 01-01-2006, 05:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pwpanas

Thanks for posting those pictures - I agree that v8 looks kind of cool in a jza80 engine bay.

On the other hand, it's kind of a shame. With the bone-stock 2jz-gte block's ability to put out over 800rwhp, there's really no need to swap it out (imo). Personally, I'd rather see a 2jz-gte being used in a '68 Cuda than a V8 in a jza80.

I totally agree with that. Plus the 2jz is lighter than the v8 which would inturn cause for better handling and better et's.

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Although it might be capable of exceeding 1520rwhp, I sincerely doubt it'll ever make enough power to "put the 2jz to shame".

I also agree as well. One must calculate hp/weight.

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This does get a bit off-topic though. Although big single turbos, v8 engine swaps and nos are all ways to make more power, I'm waiting for SKILMATIC to fess up that he's way off base with his 650rwhp on stock block & stock twins GUESS. He guessed wrong - whether it was due to faulty arithemtic or his faulty knowledge about the size of the 2jz-gte's oem twins. I think it's pretty important that guys like Evilfurby don't go away from this thread thinking that he'll be able to make 650rwhp with his '97 mk4 tt, using only the oem twins and the stock block, after he buys it.

And I am waiting for you to admit you debacled yourself. You just admitted it was attainable with the help of something so cheap as nitrous. I was waiting for you to notice your own flaw. This is the second time you have done this to yourself. I hope this isnt a habbit for you.

pwpanas · 01-01-2006, 05:46 AM

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