Supra or Firebird? Better all around?

[citationls]

I'm turning 16 soon and looking for a car that I can drift a little with. Looking for one with good hp that can spin the tires pretty easily. I've heard supras are kinda tough to drift since they are heavy but does that mean as a beginner I won't be able to drift in control? I ride other things with motors like dirt bikes and snowmobiles so I have some experience with things with engines. I'm also looking at a firebird. They seem to have good hp and I really like the sound of them. I'd probably get a trans am maybe a GTA. Does anyone know how these do for mpg vs turbo supras? Also, does anyone know which would be faster stock? A v8 firebird (transam) or a turbo supra? I'm guessing a v6 firebird wouldn't stand a chance? Which one is faster 0-60? Trans Am or Turbo Supra? Which one spins the tires more easily? Which one drifts better? Sorry for all the questions, I just really can't decide between the two cars. And I know its not the 2 most common cars to compare but thanks for the responses1
Oh, and I apologize if this post doesn't belong on this site or if its in the wrong category. I wasn't sure if it would be okay to post here.
Thanks

[Grandavi]

Originally Posted by citationls

I'm turning 16 soon and looking for a car that I can drift a little with. Looking for one with good hp that can spin the tires pretty easily. I've heard supras are kinda tough to drift since they are heavy but does that mean as a beginner I won't be able to drift in control? I ride other things with motors like dirt bikes and snowmobiles so I have some experience with things with engines. I'm also looking at a firebird. They seem to have good hp and I really like the sound of them. I'd probably get a trans am maybe a GTA. Does anyone know how these do for mpg vs turbo supras? Also, does anyone know which would be faster stock? A v8 firebird (transam) or a turbo supra? I'm guessing a v6 firebird wouldn't stand a chance? Which one is faster 0-60? Trans Am or Turbo Supra? Which one spins the tires more easily? Which one drifts better? Sorry for all the questions, I just really can't decide between the two cars. And I know its not the 2 most common cars to compare but thanks for the responses1
Oh, and I apologize if this post doesn't belong on this site or if its in the wrong category. I wasn't sure if it would be okay to post here.
Thanks

well.. hate to say it.. but if your gonna be "drifting", a Supra is fine.. the car is capable. However..its more the driver than the car in this instance. If your looking at overall construction, I would have to say the Supra is built far better than a T/A, but they are 2 different cars. Your talking V8 to inline 6. Turbo or non-turbo.. stock or modified? Im not as familiar with T/A's as I am with Camaros.. and Camaros are excellent for drifting, etc... depending on the year/motor, however, the Z28's were just made for short acceleration..

I would buy Toyota over GM any day of the week with the exception of some very old Camaros and vettes. (I like the Corvette just because...).
Do some research on the Supra's and you'll see they are built solid. However.. I haven't seen many on the road that have decent bodies and well maintained drivetrains. Usually someone (young) gets it because its a fast car and cheap and drives it to the ground.. then wonders why noone will give them 800.00 for it.. : ) Then along come us Supra fanatics..and... well.. you can guess the rest : D

[citationls]

Ok, that's kinda what I figured since the supra seems like more of a performance car and the firebird seems more of a muscle instead of handling car. The more opinions I get the better though because I'm really stuck between the two and your opinoins help me decide. I'm also looking at the barracudas/cudas now which I'm guessing I'll never find one in my price range. I was looking at monte carlos until I figured out they don't have much hp even with the big engines.
Thanks

[Grandavi]

For me.. the Supra is kinda like a dream toy. I drove my first on in 1985 (was the red "sharktail" one) and fell in love...
However, I couldnt afford one until recently.. and I ended up with a MKIII instead of the MKII.. but Im still happy : )

The car is heavy. It handles quite well, but you will feel the weight on curves. However.. I have driven muscle cars from 69 camaro, 67 vette, and up.. and they feel like they want to leave the road. Great for straight on. but dont touch the curves.. especially if there's light gravel.

If you want fun... find a Honda DelSol. Its not what I would call a "drifter" but.. man.. is it fun in a corner : )

[IHateHacks]

Buy imported.

American cars and everything bolted to them are junk, always were, always will be.

Reason why?

American auto manufacturers use standard measurements.

The rest of the world (aside from some 3rd world countries) use metric measurements.

Metric is a more precise measurement than standard, always was, always will be.

And I don't care if you believe me or not, it's a proven fact.

[BAN WS6]

I don't know why some people like to give American cars such a bad rap. I literally just created my profile on here and happened upon this thread. I own a Trans Am WS6, 2001. I'm not going to argue about claims of metric over SAE being more accurate, don't really know for sure don't really care. But calling all American cars junk is just untrue, it all has to do with how they're maintained. There have been a few flops but you can't say all American rides are junk based on a few bad examples. I've got a 93 GMC truck with over 200,000, bone stock, and still going real strong. I had a Bonneville that lasted about a week due to the ass before me not changing the oil as needed. My wife's grandfather has an old Toyota truck that went to 300,000 miles before any major problems. I also know a guy that has a Corolla that went about 50,000 before he started having major problems. Of course he road the living piss out of it every day he drove it. It all has to do with how you treat your vehicles. F-Bodies are great handling cars but as for drifting they can be a bit heavy. I've tried drifting my WS6 and it can be done, can be a little goosey coming out of the drift though. I've never driven a Supra but have lots of experience with Pony cars like Camaros and Trans Ams. If you're talking about a 3rd Gen F-body with a 350 TPI, they're respectable but not really that fast. Handling is good though and handle even better with some minor upgrades. If you go with a 4th Gen F-Body definitley get one with an LT1 or an LS1. The LT1 makes a bit more torque stock but are heavier and don't respond nearly as nicley on the top end as an LS1. Stay away from the V6 models unless you plan on turbo charging it or supercharging it, they just don't make enough horsepower. If you have the means and go the Trans Am route get one with an LS1, great horsepower from the start, respond well to mods, lots of parts for them out there, and are just plain FAST. Stock my WS6 ran mid 12's with tires, had a top end of 169, and still handled well, despite that added weight from all the leather and power seat options. Hope I helped out some with that, I can't testify to the Supra side of things, haven't driven one yet. Good luck with the search. Any further questions about them I'll be happy to answer, I've owned a 83 Trans Am and a 78 Camaro Z28 as well, so I know a bit from experience.

By the way, I'm not in here to stir up shit. In the past I've definitely been a muscle/pony car guy. I only just joined this forum to collect information on Supras. I'm thinking of starting a new project and am leaning heavily to the tuner route instead of muscle. I have a great respect for all cars unless a certain manufacturer has repeatedly put out garbage vehicles.

[Grandavi]

Originally Posted by IHateHacks

Buy imported.

American cars and everything bolted to them are junk, always were, always will be.

Reason why?

American auto manufacturers use standard measurements.

The rest of the world (aside from some 3rd world countries) use metric measurements.

Metric is a more precise measurement than standard, always was, always will be.

And I don't care if you believe me or not, it's a proven fact.

lol.. thats a little too cut and dry (and false by the way). True.. I pretty well only buy Toyota and Honda, although I have owned some American cars... but.. there are some very very good American made cars.

The imperial vs metric argument is moot really.. that goes into tolerances and your statement is just too damn loose.. lol. All manufacturers tolerances are based on a mean value and generally arent spec'd like they should. Some are better, some are worse. Now.. a Skoda... well.. thats a different story and its metric.

Anyone who plops an argument into a broad statement like you just did is just presenting a single (and very biased) statement.. and usually wrong.

Now.. if you want to argue tolerances.. than every manufactured car is crap. You want a great car.. pull it apart and put it to the exact specification it should be. The tolerances are much tighter today then they were in the 50-80's.. but balanced and blueprinted engines perform to spec. The rest are all just "acceptible". I refuse to buy new because of price and "value", plus new cars are just too electronic for me. The old ones had character and you could actually fiddle with them.

I love older mustangs.. hate newer ones. That's solely based on personal taste. However... a 240HP Chevy cobalt isnt a bad car considering the speed you get with the fuel economy.

I love my Supra. Its designed very well, but built with a truck engine modified to be a Supra engine. I can play with it, it goes great, its customizable, affordable.. but a pig on gas. There is tons wrong with it, and a lot I love about it. So.. it goes down to the fact Toyota made an excellent car poorly. lol. I think GM and Ford make poor cars excellently. Chrysler is just crap except for some older models and perhaps their Viper which is an engineering marvel. (the stealth is a fun car.. but the Chrysler tag scares me).

Anyway.. answered your response because I was bored... but the good ole USofA can actually turn out some decent cars AND by using imperial.

(however.. whoever invented philip screws should be shot)

[citationls]

As far as American cars versus import cars, I've heard that the union that american manufacturers made a while ago are now coming back to get them. And since they aren't selling as many cars the unions given to the workers is taking away too much money because they aren't making enough. So, they have to make lower quality cars that cost just as much to make up for the loss. Just a theory I heard.
But....I love the sound of the older muscle cars and the looks of them. Too bad imports can't be big block v8s. Considering how much power they get from 6 cylinders imagine how much they could get from 8
Anyways, as far as which car to get goes. I looked up which 3rd gen. models of firebirds are the fastest on a 0-60/quarter mile list and I think the fastest were the third gen. 90s formula, 91 trans am, and 90s gtas. But I want a standard so GTAs are kinda out. For supras I think 88 or 89 turbos were fastest at like .5 or 1 second behend those firebirds on 0-60 and 1/4 miles. And then of course theres the barracudas :P which I would love to have but could probably never afford or be able to find one. If I did I would bow down to it :P MR2s were another option. And I think thats it for affordable cars around the 6/7 0-60 time.

[IHateHacks]

Standard uses TPI (threads per inch) when measuring thread pitch.

Metric uses space between threads in millimeters (1, 1.25, 1.5, 1.75, etc.) when measuring thread pitch.

This is a fact and the sole basis on my point of view.

If you didn't know that or don't care to know, that's because you are some 2 bit hick that only knows how to turn a key and push a pedal.

Go work on a 20 year old American car, then go work on a 20 year old Jap car. And let me know how many american bolts you snap versus japanese bolts that snap, pal.

[Grandavi]

Originally Posted by IHateHacks

Standard uses TPI (threads per inch) when measuring thread pitch.

Metric uses space between threads in millimeters (1, 1.25, 1.5, 1.75, etc.) when measuring thread pitch.

This is a fact and the sole basis on my point of view.

If you didn't know that or don't care to know, that's because you are some 2 bit hick that only knows how to turn a key and push a pedal.

Go work on a 20 year old American car, then go work on a 20 year old Jap car. And let me know how many american bolts you snap versus japanese bolts that snap, pal.

all that is fine and dandy.. but your discounting the micrometer and a 2.5x safety factor in stress engineering.

oh.. and just to reiterate... I pretty well only buy Jap cars... because 90% of American cars suck... but that isnt due to imperial measurements